ET Jay #2 FG42+Adrenaline

[CabaL]

Have seen a lot of people say for a while that if dren gets removed from jay2, then Jay2 would become the main server over Jay1. So removing dren from Jay2 (or even changing how it works as a whole) could change server populations by quite a bit.

 

Changing charge times I feel is a bad change. Quite a few covis on Jay1 that I have seen are objective players. They smoke, satchel and open doors for various other objective players. This is why the covi is a class in the game. They can be very powerful objective players, almost as crucial as engys. Therefore changing their charge times could drastically nerf the covert ops class. Unless you change the charge consumption of other classes to compensate (which may cause MORE gas/smoke spam and more satchel spam).

 

Haven't been able to read through DD's pdf link but is it possible to make the "dren ammo" limited to 1 or 2 and make it so you cannot gain more ammo from ammo packs? Meaning only replenish-able by death?

[Xiahou Dun]

1 hour ago, N!COT!N3 said:

I think it all depends on the player….seen others suck with the fg42....and lorthae knows his fg42....same like  Xiahou Dun and Pharaoh know there shotgun

the problem is just dren ...but to take dren away from jay2...dont know how peeps will react???

 

 

I'm glad that over the span of 2500 xp I've collected on Jay2 I already am considered as "knowing my weapon" .

 

I personally dont care two bits about adrenaline, I could easily do without it as I use my charge on all classes for their purposes - medic I heal people, engi I build stuff, etc. (although I play 90% soldier with shotgun, because its so much fun compared to tryharding medic on NQ).

 

I probably shouldnt have spoken in that matter, because I am not that experienced with Jay2 yet. My view is that adrenaline can both go and stay, I myself am okay with that. Just the solution to topic at hand is limiting adrenaline in some way, not FG42.

[dasp]

23 minutes ago, ChaOs said:

Sorry but I am reacting sensitive on "secretly bullying" between the lines. In that case Jiren could have said you are just a noob. This would be more directly and more open.

 

Don't forget that Jiren doesn't speak English very good. I don't think that he is "secretly bullying between the lines" at all. (Actually he uses Google Translator)

 

And nobody is attacking you because you play with FG42+Adren. I am fine with it. When I don't feel good I move on and find a place where I feel better. Is that simple.

 

 

Edited May 20, 2020 by dasp

[ChaOs]

I am seeing double^^

1 minute ago, dasp said:

Don't forget that Jiren doesn't speak English very good. I don't think that he is "secretly bullying between the lines" at all. (Actually he uses Google Translator)

Didn't know that. But you know what I mean... Let's stay objective so. My english is also not the best btw.

3 minutes ago, dasp said:

And nobody is attacking you because you play with FG42+Adren. I am fine with it. When I don't feel good I move on and find a place where I feel better. Is that simple.

That's not what I said.

I wonder why u are not on HC with Loira ... you both don't like dren, right?

 

I don't know, if it's known, but FG42 has to be learned, to use fitting within the game.

Because it is hard to survive with it. And this is not the reason to use it. It is not the Kill/deathrate.

It is: you are able to be fast and assassinate campers quickly. And we are fearless assassins, aren't we?

 

 

 

[dasp]

6 minutes ago, ChaOs said:

I am seeing double^^

My browser died some way ..I fixed that, I hope.

 

6 minutes ago, ChaOs said:

I wonder why u are not on HC with Loira ... you both don't like dren, right?

 

The reason why I didn't move on yet, is because I actually like the people that plays on Jay2 (I mean the regulars, like Leatherface, Jiren, Osie, etc).

 

10 minutes ago, ChaOs said:

It is: you are able to be fast and assassinate campers quickly. And we are fearless assassins, aren't we?

 

There I agree with you, I also despise campers. Maybe that's the solution, I start using FG42

[ChaOs]

Just now, dasp said:

There I agree with you, I also despise campers. Maybe that's the solution, I start using FG42

Old wisemen said: When you can't beat it, use it ^^

[daredevil]

3 hours ago, dasp said:

FG42+Adren on the hands of a skilled player is just too powerful compared to other weapons together with Adren.

 

FG42 sucks at medium and longer distance because of spread. MP40 player, can roll up even snipers. With shorter distance and person who knows how to give HS, yes it's powerful. 

[daredevil]

6 hours ago, Dest!Ny said:

 

g_covertopsChargeTime would be a viable option. Nerfing that slightly would be very similar to only being able to use syringe once per life (realistically), although it should not be nerfed by a lot because they do need their stachel charge and perhaps smoke grenades.

For testing raised to 34000 from 30000

[ElEl]

1 hour ago, ChaOs said:

I don't know, if it's known, but FG42 has to be learned, to use fitting within the game.

 

No it absolutely does not. I played with it one night when I was pretty drunk on a full server and still got fragger. It's an easy weapon - especially with adrenaline. There's no skill involved: Use adrenaline, fly across the map at 100mph, hold lmb for 3 seconds, press R and repeat. I could not stop laughing at just how easy it was to play. The spread is easy to control if you fire in bursts but there's no point cause when you're drenned the best thing to do is get close enough for spread to not be a factor and you've instantly won the fight cause of the fire rate.

 

 I already made suggestions to DD to nerf it in a private message, this is what I said:

Quote

Is it possible to limit the number of FG42s? Going against 2 of these at once is just suicide cause it fires way too fast and as far as I know the entire team could just go FG42 and win easily. Lucky it hasn't happened yet.

Maybe limiting the number of covies in a team wouldn't be such a bad idea but the more I think about it, the more I don't really want it to change. Limiting covies would also limit the number of stens and k43s/garands and those do take skill to play.

 

1 hour ago, daredevil said:

For testing raised to 34000 from 30000

I don't see this helping to be honest. Most FG users just do what I said above and get 4-5 kills and then die. When they die their charge goes back to being full so they can just adrenaline straight away again. It's also the reason why limiting the number of adrenaline uses per life wouldn't work. I think all this would do is hinder objective players that use satchel and smoke grenades for team play. I really don't see a solution to the problem.

 

The FG42 is good for killing groups of campers but when there's multiple of them on a team with a cramped map, they're far worse than a group of medics could be.

 

 

I'd also like to add that removing adrenaline is just silly. It's what Jay2 is popular for and it's why I play there. I love playing fast FPS games like classic modded Doom and Jay2's settings are wonderful to play with. We have plenty of servers without adrenaline so why change Jay2?

[dasp]

8 minutes ago, ElEl said:

 

The FG42 is good for killing groups of campers but when there's multiple of them on a team with a cramped map, they're far worse than a group of medics could be.

That’s exactly what happens on maps like purefrag. A lot of players choose FG42 and make the map not enjoyable at all. Also that map should have a smaller limit of max players, the map is way too small for so many people.

[ChaOs]

3 minutes ago, ElEl said:

No it absolutely does not. I played with it one night when I was pretty drunk on a full server and still got fragger. It's an easy weapon - especially with adrenaline. There's no skill involved: Use adrenaline, fly across the map at 100mph, hold lmb for 3 seconds, press R and repeat. I could not stop laughing at just how easy it was to play. The spread is easy to control if you fire in bursts but there's no point cause when you're drenned the best thing to do is get close enough for spread to not be a factor and you've instantly won the fight cause of the fire rate.

It absolutely does. Like you said some sentences later: "..4-5 kills until they die.." this shows the short life of a covie dudie.

And when you only go for killing and evidence THIS by killing some dudies, then you got what i meant: no teamplay, just ego play.

 

Also: when the FG42 is soooo strong, each player would use it. But the player who use covie is limited per default. So limit it to "2" per team and nothing of interest will change.

And then let us limit the (rambo)medics to 2 per team, deal? A team don't need 5 medics reviving each other camping in a bank.

 

 

[ElEl]

47 minutes ago, dasp said:

That’s exactly what happens on maps like purefrag. A lot of players choose FG42 and make the map not enjoyable at all. Also that map should have a smaller limit of max players, the map is way too small for so many people.

It's set to a max of 30 players right now, with some testing I've found this includes specs. That's 15v15 worst case scenario which personally I think is fine, usually it'll be a max of ~12v12 though. I enjoy Purefrag with a lot of targets so I don't have to go hunting for people. What would you suggest?

 

49 minutes ago, ChaOs said:

It absolutely does.

I disagree completely but let's leave that there cause it seems it's only going to start an argument.

 

51 minutes ago, ChaOs said:

Like you said some sentences later: "..4-5 kills until they die.." this shows the short life of a covie dudie.

If you re-read my post I said MOST FG users, not all. But, if you want to disprove what you think I'm saying and get a k:d ratio of 4:1 or better on a full server then feel free try. Regardless, what I said is the current meta that many people see on the server and the problem we're talking about.

 

55 minutes ago, ChaOs said:

And when you only go for killing and evidence THIS by killing some dudies, then you got what i meant: no teamplay, just ego play.

 

Usually the team with the highest fragger is the winning team. You can go for kills and still help your team so long as you're not one of those people that just camp in the same place all game. You can't expect to win the game as the attacking team without getting kills cause that's just stupid.

 

55 minutes ago, ChaOs said:

But the player who use covie is limited per default.

Explain please.

 

59 minutes ago, ChaOs said:

So limit it to "2" per team and nothing of interest will change.

And then let us limit the (rambo)medics to 2 per team, deal? A team don't need 5 medics reviving each other camping in a bank.

I presented limiting the number of covies as a potential solution and showed the problems that would bring. Not sure why you took that point to heart considering I said it wouldn't solve the problem. 🤷‍♂️

[daredevil]

I am just thinking to limit adren to 2 if possible and that would resolve the issue. Also, remove adren from medics all together again if possible. 

[ElEl]

50 minutes ago, daredevil said:

I am just thinking to limit adren to 2 if possible and that would resolve the issue.

As I said previously, the meta is just to let yourself die after a few kills so that you respawn with full ammo (I think 170 bullets total) and full charge so you can adrenaline straight away.

 

51 minutes ago, daredevil said:

Also, remove adren from medics all together again if possible. 

I'm strongly against this, I definitely think we should do a poll before we make such a major change. 

[K.LisTa]

Adrenaline was fine on this server 10 years ago, when you had 20vs20+ fights every evening. It allowed you to press forward, and gave you an incentive to attack the front line. If you wanted to steal the gold from the bank of the default Goldrush map, you needed to have adrenaline to avoid being obliterated as soon as you enter the bank by the 8 -10 axis campers.

 

The server isn't as popular anymore. The majority of the time, there are a few bots on the server. What's the point of adrenaline during a 6vs6 fight ? It's no longer a gimmick to help you survive pushing forward, it becomes a "f*** you I win this 1vs1 regardless of your actions". If you're a good player, you can even pin down the whole enemy team on your own.

 

It also encourages a behavior which is, in my opinion, is toxic as hell : there are players who spawn, rush to the enemy spawn, use adrenaline and spawnkill. Die eventually. Rinse and repeat. They spend whole maps spawnkilling, nothing else. They get good amount of kills and they're happy with that. Well, while the rules allow it, I'm not sure people enjoy having to deal with a medic or a flamer under adrenaline every time they spawn.

 

It also goes against any kind of teamplay : you don't want to heal others or give ammunition. If you do you're actually shooting yourself in the foot since you're delaying your access to adrenaline.

 

And lastly adrenaline makes landmines and rifles grenades a complete joke. On NQ1 they are borderline OP, on this server, you laugh when you see them.

Edited May 21, 2020 by K.LisTa