The UK's EU referendum

[Bowly]

 

Countries dont need to be members for access. The UK will still have complete access to the EU market no matter what, as every EU country is a member of the WTO. The whole world has access the EU market in this way. And given that as far as I know the EU trades more to the UK than the UK trades to the EU, if they don’t do a deal it will cost EU countries more than the UK.

It seems unlikely there will be problems getting a good trade deal unless they want to hurt themselves more, and even if there is not it will just be standard WTO trading as a result (as I said, worse for the EU than the UK).

 

 

 

Dude, britain didn't want all the EU regulations on products. if they want a trade agreement they will have to agree to those rules anyways. (now without any voice to possibly change them).

 

between 53 and 58% of britains export goes to Europe ...

 

And no, without the EU the immigration crisis is not solvable. Now the EU has to power to divide the refugees amongst all countries. If it weren't for the EU there would be alot of countries who would refuse to accept any at all. And what countries you talking about, turkey?

[kami]

May I ask where you get your numbers from? UKs trade balance has been negative with the EU-countries and non-EU-countries for years.
Imports from the EU: 75B
Imports from non-EU: 72B
Exports to the EU: 45B
Exports to non-EU: 50B
Those are numbers of this year till April.
And sure you guys can get WTO type contracts with the EU those include tariffs for e.g. food 15%, cars 10% and car parts 5%. And from what I have learned in the university tariffs have a huge negative impact on the economy. Furthermore every professor I had agreed on the EU being the biggest contributor to the wealth of all members.

On a different note:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/brexit-eu-referendum-racial-racism-abuse-hate-crime-reported-latest-leave-immigration-a7104191.html
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/26/spate-of-racist-attacks-blamed-on-brexit-vote/
I guess 'polish vermin' is not racist but just an endearing name. Right guys?

 

[DrPotato]

Dude, britain didn't want all the EU regulations on products. if they want a trade agreement they will have to agree to those rules anyways. (now without any voice to possibly change them).

 

between 53 and 58% of britains export goes to Europe ...

 

And no, without the EU the immigration crisis is not solvable. Now the EU has to power to divide the refugees amongst all countries. If it weren't for the EU there would be alot of countries who would refuse to accept any at all. And what countries you talking about, turkey?

 

http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20160105160709/http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/international-transactions/outward-foreign-affiliates-statistics/how-important-is-the-european-union-to-uk-trade-and-investment-/sty-eu.html

 

According to the national archives it was 54% in 1999 and 44% by 2014. Over the past 18 months this has actually ranged from 38% to 48% - no mention of 53.

 

12% of GDP is reliant on the EU trade only, 88% on the rest of the world.

 

You misunderstand the argument on regulation, while a member of the EU everything we produce and send to any country (or otherwise) has to be to regulations from the EU with no control by the UK. Outside of the EU only what the UK trades with them has to be to EU regulations and the UK controls all its own regulations regardless on all other trade (and on everything else as well).

 

And if you want to believe the only way to solve the immigration crisis is by being a member of something that would not actually affect any treaties the EU would want to make and agree with the UK then that is up to you.

 

 

May I ask where you get your numbers from? UKs trade balance has been negative with the EU-countries and non-EU-countries for years.

Imports from the EU: 75B

Imports from non-EU: 72B

Exports to the EU: 45B

Exports to non-EU: 50B

Those are numbers of this year till April.

And sure you guys can get WTO type contracts with the EU those include tariffs for e.g. food 15%, cars 10% and car parts 5%. And from what I have learned in the university tariffs have a huge negative impact on the economy. Furthermore every professor I had agreed on the EU being the biggest contributor to the wealth of all members.

 

 

 

And those WTO contract go both ways and cost the exact same amount for the EU countries, except it will include poorer countries who will be hit even harder and car producing countries that the UK produces very little of. The EU will not want WTO tariffs as much, and probably more so, than the UK leaving no appetite for a failure to secure a good trade deal. There is also the ability to now freely negotiate better trade with any other country/countries we want, rather than the currently enforced tariffs EU membership makes certain of.

 

The UK is generally a net importer from the EU, there are fluctuations but this is generally true over a year.

From the UK Trade Info website, https://www.uktradeinfo.com/Statistics/OTS%20Releases/OTS_Release_0416.pdf

 

"EU Exports for April 2016 were £12.0 billion. This remained unchanged compared with last month." while "EU Imports for April 2016 were £19.1 billion. This was a decrease of £1.0 billion (4.9 per cent) compared with last month"

 

Your numbers show the same thing, which is exactly what I was saying so I am not sure why you asked where I got my numbers from.

 

 

Give the previous link I gave a read (in the other post) if you want a grounding of the basic economic principles of why some of us who want to leave believe it is the better option. Other than that I do really think we should all leave it now otherwise this could go on and on (after any replies to this, I will gladly read them first).

Edited June 27, 2016 by SadElf

[Ann!b@l]

Some economists who are for leaving put together an interesting pamphlet on the British economy and the EU, it is worth a read if anyone wants to see another view on the subject.

 

https://issuu.com/efbkl/docs/economists_for_brexit_-_the_economy

You base here your arguments on the work\quotes of such groups of economists who are and work fiercely against EU. But like all arguments, they can be contradicted if you don't show enough neutrality even with numbers.

 

example:

However, all of these assumptions, overt and implicit, can be challenged. For instance, in terms of climate change legislation, Congdon asserts:

 

The EU bureaucracy has accepted the so-called "warmist" doctrine that, because of the carbon emissions arising from modern industrialism, mankind is largely to blame for the global warming of recent decades. The purpose of the 2009 Renewables Directive is, explicitly, to move towards a 20% drop in the EU's carbon emissions by raising the proportion of electricity generated by renewables (wind, wave, solar and so on) to 20% by 2020. The cost of electricity generation by means of renewable energy is much higher than that by conventional methods (gas and coal firing, mostly). For example, electricity from offshore wind farms costs at least three times as much to produce as electricity from a gas-fired combined-cycle power station.

 

Thus, Congdon would have it that all climate change costs are attributable to the EU, something which simply isn't the case. Firstly, the fount of the all evil, so to speak, is the UNFCCC (UN Framework Convention on Climate Change) as advised by the IPCC, along with the Kyoto Protocol, to which the UK is not only a signatory but one of the more enthusiastic contributors. 

 

To that extent, the EU is largely implementing international treaties, and – as evidenced by its Climate Change Act - the UK has gone further than EU requirements. Even without the EU, the UK would have adopted Kyoto and much more, so UK climate change regulatory costs cannot be attributed to the EU, even when they have an EU label.

source: http://www.eureferendum.com/blogview.aspx?blogno=84342

 

 

 

An other example of article from renowned economists but with a different point of view even though more moderate in opinions and less partisan on the matter: http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jun/19/eu-referendum-nobel-prize-winning-economists-warn-of-long-term-brexit-damage

Edited June 27, 2016 by Ann!b@l

[Jobba]

I'm totally for Britain's Independence! 

[Ann!b@l]

I'm totally for Britain's Independence! 

And we europeans respect and accept this decision. But now if I'm not wrong, Scotland and Northern Ireland ask for this same independence. Will Britain respects and accepts this democratic choice aswell? I'm asking because Scotland want to remain in EU, so we feel concerned.

[Platonic]

EU is getting blame for a neo-liberal economy system and policy that has obviously been supported by the UK and almost every other political entity. Nations have been using the EU as "the reason for this bad policy" over and over while they (the nations of the EU) are the ones voting the laws. I'm really curious how the poor will gain from strong internal borders, import taxes and an anti-migrant policy.

 

What a farty way to decide about a complex problem anyway... EU: yes or no? It's like asking... This guy stole a car... Death penalty or let him walk freely?

[Raskin]

 !news goldrush....lol...yeah been drinking a bit....sorry...kinda true tho

[SiD]

Can't wait to move to Canada...

 

Wouldn't be too proud of that.

 

We've got just as big of a problem with dumb f*** conservative religious xenophobes. And Racists. lots of those.  Not to mention the most expensive cable/internet companies, scores of moronic naturopaths and anti-vaxxers, and a large following of 'Freemen on the Land'.

 

Canada isn't the romantic idea of love and kindness everyone seems to think it is.

[Sisje]

Wouldn't be too proud of that.

 

We've got just as big of a problem with dumb f*** conservative religious xenophobes. And Racists. lots of those.  Not to mention the most expensive cable/internet companies, scores of moronic naturopaths and anti-vaxxers, and a large following of 'Freemen on the Land'.

 

Canada isn't the romantic idea of love and kindness everyone seems to think it is.

They have problems anywhere... It's really hard to get into canada too it seems but there is something called love involved so I'll do it anyway