Johnwick Posted April 29 Posted April 29 37 minutes ago, MoFo said: Doesn't ring a bell 😉 A full Jay1 tries to redirect you to Jay2, so I guess I assumed it was the same. The adren sounds familiar, so I must have played there. I think that is the main reason I don't player there actually. But what is the traffic like? Does it have it's own regulars? Jay 2 mostly empty,i dont know does i have seen ever there 5vs5 players ,i wonder is it even worth to keep up. Quote
Platinum VIP Snake in the Grass Posted April 29 Platinum VIP Posted April 29 17 hours ago, mraw435 said: Glad to see ya on the forums Mofo - your sniping me has frequently led me to nearly break my desk as I slam my fists down! Specifically on Minas when you are still hiding in the grass and hitting me off the walls near the ...3rd...gate i think! 3 hours ago, MoFo said: Doesn't ring a bell 😉 Man, arent you a real MOFO... @mraw435 Btw, it's way more common to have him snipe us when we defend gate #4 (although he always uses same spots). Quote
Platinum VIP Jesus Posted April 30 Platinum VIP Posted April 30 (edited) 5 plus years ago there was a topic and im not to savvy with the forums so Im not sure how to post it, but it was about Covie with Fg42 stating that combo was the strongest class/roll. Changes were made that still affect all servers with Arden today. Covies only get adren once every minute. That being said. I dont think medic is the strongest class. I still think Covert Op with FG 42 is the strongest. Just wanted to throw that out there because I see people saying that allowing medics to heal from poison knives would just make the strongest class stronger when medic being the strongest class has already been debunked. Also im not sure about this option, but in silent if you get hit by a poison syringe you can kill a medic and heal from it. Does that currently apply in Jay1 with poison knives? Edited April 30 by Jesus 2 Quote
Pear Posted April 30 Posted April 30 (edited) 1 hour ago, Jesus said: 5 plus years ago there was a topic and im not to savvy with the forums so Im not sure how to post it, but it was about Covie with Fg42 stating that combo was the strongest class/roll. Changes were made that still affect all servers with Arden today. Covies only get adren once every minute. That being said. I dont think medic is the strongest class. I still think Covert Op with FG 42 is the strongest. Just wanted to throw that out there because I see people saying that allowing medics to heal from poison knives would just make the strongest class stronger when medic being the strongest class has already been debunked. Also im not sure about this option, but in silent if you get hit by a poison syringe you can kill a medic and heal from it. Does that currently apply in Jay1 with poison knives? You can only get healed directly by teammates ( or enemies if for some reason they throw packs at you) or cabinets in jay 1 , can't pick up packs. Adrenaline is disabled also , do you play on jay1? , sorry but saying that fg42 covie is stronger than medic or even remotely comparable on jaymod1(really on anymod with no adre) is way out of touch. Sure could work in some maps (short range) but it's nowhere near as effective as an smg. You almost never see any1 top fragging with the fg ( maybe in ctf castle but very rare) and I never see any1 using it period in comp settings/legacy. Edited April 30 by Pear Typo Quote
HarryAimpotter Posted May 1 Posted May 1 On 4/27/2025 at 8:50 PM, Lusciousdrunk said: I want to say it’s 20-25 seconds but I’m not 100% sure. Will have to check on that. I did check that. Full level fop arty lasts 15 seconds in jay1. 2 Quote
Dest!Ny Posted May 3 Posted May 3 Well well well, history repeats itself once again. Topics like these come up from time to time but usually don't lead anywhere. Usually the topic derails a bit as there will always be a few readers who will take constructive feedback as an attack or attempt to make medic stronger. Disagreements aren't properly resolved and eventually the topic kind of dies off in an inconclusive way. This is unfortunately one of the reasons that this part of the forums isn't visited often these days (one topic per month this year excluding map suggestions). Nevertheless, thank you @MoFo for opening the conversation, I can tell that your interest in the betterness of the server and not just your own personal benefit. On 4/26/2025 at 8:18 AM, MoFo said: 1. Nothing scales Add limits to rifle grenades and grenades. I don't have a good number for rifle grenades, but you shouldn't need to hold more than 2 grenades. imo riflenades don't need to be adjusted. Nades could be limited to something like 4-6 depending on class but with the respawn and movement speed that jay1 allows, you will hardly feel the impact. Since there are people in the thread that want to talk about nerving medics (I will get to that), I don't mind the idea of severly limiting or out-right removing nades for medics as a start Adjust artillery duration. It feels like artillery can be called as soon as the previous one finishes with a full level lieutenant. This prevents opportunities to push between artillery strikes. With current settings, arty does not need to be changed. The real cause of this are the chokepoints in certain maps and how between two consecutive arties the area will still be occupied with mortar, nades, panzer, etc. The only frustrating thing about arty is the few people who want to hoard the arty and prefer to call it in a sub-optimal spot just to not let another fop take the arty away. There would be possible ways to avoid that (less fops or making recharge rate higher than the time between arties so arties will tend to alternate more between different fops) but if that will make the chokepoints even more contested I'm not sure it's worth exploring Adjust panzer fire rate or reload time. If the player using a panzer also has access to an MP40/Thompson, they shouldn't be able to rally off panzer shots at that rate. The panzer felt like a balance part of the game in RTCW, but that class somehow got a boost in almost every conceivable way on Jay1. This is not a good argument as many panzer players will avoid using their secondary weapon almost at all. I don't know the exact time it takes between shots but I believe if you kill yourself in your shot, you respawn with charge (correct me if I'm wrong). If this could be changed to respawn witht he charge you died with, it could incentivize a more "fun" (subjective) playstyle The easiest thing to do would be to limit the player count to something like 16v16. This would solve a lot by itself, and maybe even send some traffic over to the lonely Jay2. This has been suggested many times (I think also by me?) but is not going to happen 2. Recognize which weapons are only 'fun' for the players using them Knives. This may be the most obvious one. Having a weapon in the game that makes it so another player can't really play the game anymore seems crazy to me. I've never experience a weapon like that before in an FPS, and I hope never to again. But if it's here to stay, it should be far less impactful. I've seen whole squads get taken out because someone threw a knife. Friendly medics put down their weapons to help a teammate(because teamwork is good, right?) only to get steamrolled by the other team. When the best option is to NOT help your teammate, it's worth reviewing in my opinion. Let medics heal themselves. I may never understand the logic behind this choice. If a medic has to pull out health packs in the middle of a fight and you STILL can't kill him, then you don't deserve the kill. This one seems obvious to me. I don't think this will be fair to other classes but I do think that you should be able to pick up medpacks from gibbed enemies/allies which will benefit every class and slightly nerf medics using throwing knives Knives deal a ridiculous amount of initial damage. They shouldn't do more damage than a bullet, right? See argument above. In base Jaymod I think a headshot does 50 damage but for some reason it does 100 in jay1 (correct me if I'm wrong). I do think this could be tinkered with which will especially help non-medics that might not enter the combat at full hp to begin with Limit knives to 2 max. If you miss a shot, you are able to pick up the knife again. This doesn't apply to any other weapon, so there should be more focus on limiting how many you can have. I don't think this will really benefit anyone and will just make knives more frustrating to use Mines. This is one of the worst ideas for an FPS. Any weapon in an FPS should require you to 'aim' to some degree. But as I said before, I'm not here to argue their removal. Increase the time is takes to plant a mine. Planting a mine in real life takes quite a bit of time I imagine. While understanding that this is a game, maybe planting a minefield in 30 seconds is a bit much. I don't think this is the root cause of any negative you experience and will only make using landmines more frustrating Decrease the time it take to 'detect' a mine. Some people enjoy spectating as much as playing, and watching a player spend time detecting mines for their team is probably as boring as it is for the player. That time is better spent engaging the enemy, but teamwork is good, right? Really like the idea. I think it makes sense to spot mines more quickly on a fast paced server like jay1 Mortar. This falls under that "Sometimes you just die" category. Maybe slow the fire rate? Decrease the AOE? I don't know. It's too similar to artillery, and nobody asked for more artillery. It's almost as mindless as mines, but requires the minimal amount of aim(if you want to call it that). Similar to Arty, I don't think this needs to be changed. Many mortar users will settle on a single spot to shoot at and it's easy enough to avoid. There are some that can very quickly alternate between hotspots but my hats goes off to them, that's a skill. 2. Sten Increase the bullets in takes to overheat, or decrease the cool-down rate. This should absolutely be addressed and it's quite unfortunate how the previous topic was handled Adjust the falloff damage so the only upside the sten has isn't negated. I think it could be nice to reduce the fall off damage for headshots. This is how damage fall off is calculated in Jaymod: // Allow for distance falloff if (distanceFalloff) damage = G_DistanceFalloffAdjustment( damage, trx.flen, 0.5f ); // where: int G_DistanceFalloffAdjustment(int damage, float distance, float falloff) { // zinx - start at 100% at 1500 units (and before), // and go to falloff at 2500 units (and after) // 1500 to 2500 -> 0.0 to 1.0 float scale = (distance - 1500.f) / (2500.f - 1500.f); // 0.0 to 1.0 -> 0.0 to (1 - falloff) scale *= (1 - falloff); // 0.0 to (1 - falloff) -> 1.0 to falloff scale = 1.0f - scale; // And, finally, cap it. if (scale >= 1.0f) { scale = 1.0f; } else if (scale < falloff) { scale = falloff; } return int( damage * scale ); } This could be changed to: if (distanceFalloff) { if (mod == MOD_HEADSHOT) { damage = G_DistanceFalloffAdjustment(damage, trx.flen, 0.8f); // less falloff } else { damage = G_DistanceFalloffAdjustment(damage, trx.flen, 0.5f); // default } } Which will benefit all but especially Sten as it has lower spread on longer range Comments in quote marked red 2 Quote
Dest!Ny Posted May 3 Posted May 3 A few more posts I wanted to comment on that are not directly related with the original post: On 4/26/2025 at 1:38 PM, ELSO said: Isn't it the point that everyone finds something fun? You are very skilled player and your good aim might not be fun for others, should we make smgs weaker then? This is the first time in this topic where this is addressed: "it's not something that ruins the fun". This is very interesting to me because what does it mean that something "ruins the fun". Aren't people just playing? Are there people playing with the intention of ruining the fun for others? What are the intentions of people playing specific weapons or playstyles? And the most important question, how can we make sure that regardless of intention, playstyle, or personal objective in the game, everyone can co-exist together? Because that is what jay1 is about if you were to ask me. One example is the restriction on heavy weapons. The game allows for more panzer and mortar users but we choose not to. Why would we do this if there would definitely be people waiting in line to take the second panzer slot? It's not because we want to ruin these people's fun, but we believe it will harm more the fun of the rest of the server. Many changes that we can make will make a relatively small impact to your experience and still benefit the balance of the game, whether the weapon you use gets nerfed or buffed. Sometimes these topics derail because people believe the intention is to nerf a weapon to the point it becomes unusable while we can remove 10% of AOE damage from the panzer and you will not even notice it (random example). On 4/27/2025 at 1:39 AM, tipsy said: With all the whining and suggestions, if any of you notice, nobody is complaining about medic class. If you see those good shooters on the server, they are mostly complaining of "spam" on Jay1 and keep asking to apply restrictions to weapons and class and other stuff to make "their own gameplay time" more "enjoyable and comfortable." but they never talk about how powerful medic class is, and how medic class has more HP compared to any other class, or how much faster medic class recovers HP and steps to make medic class less powerful. Isn't this hypocrisy? When you point one finger toward others, 3 fingers are pointed toward you. No, this isn't hypocracy. Medics know they can heal themselves back up so it is more natural to take risks and enter the spam, that's why they die more by it and are more likely to complain about it. On the opposite side of the coin, engis and fops might be more cautious around spam and will instead choose to hold back little and maybe throw a nade (feeding the cycle) or pick a long distance fight. Spammers prey on medics while medics prey on spammers, it's natural that one complains about the other, not hypocritical. As someone who plays Medic maybe 90%+ of the time, I am by no means opposed to nerving the class if there is something clearly unfair about it. My personal frustration with medics are those who are on 40hp and will run away and heal after they feel that they will lose the 1v1. But please come with actual suggestions rather than just naysaying the OP, nobody is pointing fingers. On 4/27/2025 at 6:03 PM, Lusciousdrunk said: I wouldn’t say he is shitting on your suggestion just offering a different point of view. He also has a point, 90% of the people wanting to make changes to the settings on Jay1 play medic and nothing else. You are somewhat the exception because you play covy but not any of the other classes. This might very well be correct, but what is the conclusion that you want to take from that? If 90% of people suggesting changes are medics does that mean medics are inherently more "whiny" or could it mean that heavy weapon players have less to complain about? Let's keep an open mind and listen to genuine feedback, especially when you keep hearing the same few complaints over and over. On 4/27/2025 at 11:27 PM, Lusciousdrunk said: This is why I agreed with what @tipsy was saying to a certain point. Y’all play the same class every single time you are on. Medic. You have no problem with unlimited med packs to heal yourself. You have no problem with there being no limit to how many medics there can be on each team. You said it yourself that most of the time you can’t even get healed by medics on your own team. There are usually 10 per side when the server is full. Sometimes more. If you look at this from an outsiders perspective, it would look like you want to weaken every class, but medic, to make it easier for yourself and for people who play like you to get kills. Is that the case? Idk and I don’t care. If we did what you suggested the 10 people who play nothing but rambo medic would be happy, while EVERYONE else would be upset or grumbling. It’s not a comp or scrim server. Like I said we have Silent, Legacy and HC that have settings that are more in tuned with what you are looking for. I feel like this goes back to previous points. First of all, balance changes can benefit everyone, not just medics. Saying that "the 10 people who play nothing but rambo medic would be happy" is very diminishing towards the well intended post. Balancing the different classes in the game does not only benefit those who play for kills as you say, but also helps objective players. It's all about what you change and how. What comes to mind are maps where you need to collect/deliver an objective from/to a small room (goldrush, hanted mansion, river port, fuel depot) where a guarded flamethrower can make it next to impossible for allies to progress. In the past, I remember seeing suggestions to make the flamethrower inflict damage on the user. Would that make medics and other classes more powerful? Yes. Would it be more healthy for objective players? Also yes. There is a world of things that can be done that will make the vast majority of players not "upset or grumbling" On 4/29/2025 at 4:11 AM, hyness said: Rambo medics do just as much damage as any other class/weapon on Jay1. On multiple occasions you dismiss any mention of medics using an SMG as skillful and not any problem, while all the other weapons are not, totally dismissing the ability to self-heal being as just as destructive as a poison knife This kind of goes back to what I was saying in response to ELSO and tipsy. Classes doing "damage" to the server is hard to measure (unless you are talking literally ). MoFo isn't also mentioning "all other weapons"; Shotgun, FG42, Mg42, Sniper, Flamethrower are not even mentioned. Sten is even mentioned to be buffed. Let's look at what is actually brought on the table before we make such claims. That said, self-healing is destructive? As a medic, I would say I partially agree. Therefor, please do the same as MoFo did and make a topic about it with a suggestion on how to improve this imbalance. But that should not factor as a discredit of this topic. On 4/30/2025 at 7:55 AM, Pear said: sorry but saying that fg42 covie is stronger than medic or even remotely comparable on jaymod1(really on anymod with no adre) is way out of touch. Sure could work in some maps (short range) but it's nowhere near as effective as an smg. You almost never see any1 top fragging with the fg ( maybe in ctf castle but very rare) and I never see any1 using it period in comp settings/legacy. Interesting point! So this comes down to what you would define as "strong". From experience, I can tell you that in terms of weapons, fg42 might be the strongest weapon in jaymod (at a short or short to medium range). In a fair 1v1 against a fg42 on that range I will easily lose 50% of battles if not more and I'm a pretty okay shot. The problem (and what makes medic so good at racking up kills) is that most 1v1's aren't inherently fair. A medic always has the oppurtunity to heal up and engage a 1v1 at full hp while the rest of classes spend more time respawning and rushing back to the frontline. Medics are powerful because they have a very decent weapon at their disposal and can spend more time actively in the front. You ca verify this youself when you look at the kills+deaths (= total engagements) of a rambo medic compared to any other class, medics just have more engagements and thus more chances to get kills. 1 2 Quote
Platinum VIP -=HipKat=- Posted May 4 Platinum VIP Posted May 4 17 hours ago, Dest!Ny said: Well well well, history repeats itself once again. Topics like these come up from time to time but usually don't lead anywhere. Usually the topic derails a bit as there will always be a few readers who will take constructive feedback as an attack or attempt to make medic stronger. Disagreements aren't properly resolved and eventually the topic kind of dies off in an inconclusive way. This is unfortunately one of the reasons that this part of the forums isn't visited often these days (one topic per month this year excluding map suggestions). Nevertheless, thank you @MoFo for opening the conversation, I can tell that your interest in the betterness of the server and not just your own personal benefit. Funny, this is the exact post I was expecting to make myself Quote
PHNTM Posted May 6 Posted May 6 (edited) @Dest!Ny Thank you kindly pointing this out good sir. History will keep repeating itself I'm sure. Thank you @MoFo for the time you've put behind your posts. I'm sure they will be thoroughly ignored/dismissed in any practical form but this is the best post about jay 1's imbalances in a long long time. Edited May 6 by PHNTM 1 Quote
MoFo Posted May 6 Author Posted May 6 Thank you all who have taken the time to provide constructive feedback on these suggestions. While there were quite a few I laid out, I want to make sure folks understand that implementing them - even if the majority of players agreed on all of them - should never be done simultaneously. A single change may or may not create an undesirable side-effect. Making several changes at once would undoubtedly make one of these side-effects harder to diagnose, as there are now more variables to consider. Also, it was never my intent to advocate for drastic changes on Jay1. I play there all the time as well, for good reason. Most of the changes I suggest are measurable, and should be done gradually. @Dest!Ny posted above a possible adjustment to the Sten's fall-off damage. This is a perfect example of a measurable change that can be adjusted incrementally in order to make the Sten a more useful weapon, and not just a personal challenge(which is why I ever really use it). I think a lot of players would utilize the Sten more if it was just a bit easier to use. Some changes are not able to be handled in that same way, though. Letting medics self-heal when poisoned is an example of a more drastic change that cannot be incrementally implemented. While "This would make medics too strong" is a valid argument, there are also counter-arguments to this point. Maybe this would actually result in less medics since the only way to counter poison knives is with more medics. Maybe this would result in more sustained pushes that have only a single medics backing them. Let's use 'mines' as another example. Would shortening the detection time of a mine to something like 2 seconds have a positive of negative impact on the overall game play? How about making is so teammates will set off mines as well? They should be able to avoid them since they can already see them, right? In the cases where they are unavoidable, consider then that they're also unavoidable for the opposing team as well. The point is, you're never going to know either way unless you're willing to make a change, and then take the time to observe any affects it may have. And since Jay1 has a broad range of players throughout the day, these changes need to be observed during both high and low traffic times. If no real changes are observed, everyone can reconvene and discuss why this might be. Maybe a further adjustment can be made(if possible) until SOME observable impact can be made, be it desirable or undesirable. I'm not sure if anyone else has noticed this on Jay1, but when there server is full(or near full), the defending team on any current map has a much higher win-rate than when that same map is played during low-traffic times. Obviously not all maps are the same and teams are often unbalanced, but generally speaking, it's somewhat predictable which team will will during these times with surprising accuracy. Axis win-rate on Goldrush with 20+ players per team I imagine is somewhere near 65%-70%. But play that same map with only 10 per team or less...that win-rate swings drastically in the allies favor. Glaring issues like this may be the most frustrating as a Jay1 lover. It's right there in everyone face, but nothing is ever done to mitigate it. While capping the player count would most likely solve this issue(and many more) on it's own, it sounds like that change is out of the question. So what else can be done? Maybe small changes to the some spam weapons? Who knows what the right answer is, or if one even exists. To reiterate my point above, trying nothing seems like the wrong solution to a problem. On a side note: I wonder what everyone's definition of a 'Rambo medic' is. I don't want to derail this topic, but it's becoming apparent that not everyone is using that word with the same context. 1 1 Quote
Platinum VIP -=HipKat=- Posted May 7 Platinum VIP Posted May 7 13 hours ago, MoFo said: I'm not sure if anyone else has noticed this on Jay1, but when there server is full(or near full), the defending team on any current map has a much higher win-rate than when that same map is played during low-traffic times. Obviously not all maps are the same and teams are often unbalanced, but generally speaking, it's somewhat predictable which team will will during these times with surprising accuracy. Axis win-rate on Goldrush with 20+ players per team I imagine is somewhere near 65%-70%. But play that same map with only 10 per team or less...that win-rate swings drastically in the allies favor. Glaring issues like this may be the most frustrating as a Jay1 lover. It's right there in everyone face, but nothing is ever done to mitigate it. While capping the player count would most likely solve this issue(and many more) on it's own, it sounds like that change is out of the question. So what else can be done? Maybe small changes to the some spam weapons? Who knows what the right answer is, or if one even exists. To reiterate my point above, trying nothing seems like the wrong solution to a problem. Fact! Typically, I sit in spec until just before each map starts and then join the weakest team. I can tell you which team I'll end up with almost certainty, depending on how many players are on. I can also tell you with the same amount of certainty, some players and which team they'll be on, because they typically end up on the strongest team. Meaning that player, when it's full, will be on the defending team and when it's not so full, will be on the attacking team. Quote
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