States want to Secede

[b0rR*4cHo]

Booo YAaaaaaa

[Dddrgn]

I would so move to Canada if possible, this country has constantly become even more messed up, look at all the debt we are in! for pity's sake, all the people in the government are really there for (seems to be) is the money. I can't say I'm super knowledgeable about politics or things like that considering I am 17, but I know enough to say out-right that our country has been digging it's own grave for years.

[parrot]

1) Why are people freaking out now? Where were you during W's escapades? ^^Not you Dddrgn, I know you were in elementary school

2) The nation is not a private household! We are more like a business, and thus use debt for investment just like companies do. We instead look at the debt load as a percentage of revenue and also the ability to make good on any further debt. Proper investment leqads to increased econimic growth, which leads to more revenue, which means we keep paying our debts with no trouble.

3) Based on those factors, we are not as underwater as Glenn Beck would like to have us believe.

4) Even so, I want to see some more restraint on where we spend our money. Throwing it away is still bad...

[=Death Hunter=]

The police keep your home safe. The feds build you nice roads to travel to work on. The army keeps our country safe from external threats.

 

 

Lol hold on a minute. Police drive around popping speeders and handing out misdemeanors for pot possesion. They get calls. They don't sit around my house and protect it.

 

2:the feds build our roads??? Did congress get out there and grunt out those overpasses? Wouldn't it be great to know Janet Reno was out there replacing a broken ditch tile??? BS we built that shit with money they took from us in the first place. Now that I'm on the topic about 3 miles down the road from my house there is a plague on a pole that states that the old highway I lived on was funded by 3 local men in the 1800's. It's a good 15 miles stretch between towns. You think Andrew Jackson was out there plugging away with a pickaxe and shovel? No. Hell no. For a president of this great country to have the audacity to go out there publically and tell small business owners "You didn't build that!" is a shame. And it becomes a big black mark when people look past that. What people need to understand is the government produces nothing. Absolutely nothing. They cannot produce unless they take. Just because they take our money and have it arranged to build roads doesn't mean we can't do it ourselves...like we do anyways...and it most certainly doesn't mean we need them. I wonder how the old blacksmiths and tavern owners got their metal and booze way back when before concrete??? It's just a mystery I guess.

 

And 3:as of Sept 11th 2001 it is very apparent what "our" armies have done for us. The military industrial complex is out of control!!! Eisenhower warned us with about this great threat. We have been reaping what "our government" has sowed. We barge into countries slaughter people innocent and foe. We bomb their towns and villages and cities. Then we take over. We steal resources and build a base there. There is literally nothing in Afghanistan but the worlds Opium supply, Lithium deposits, and some goats. Nomads and desert people. And we're still there!!! We have to wait on Cheney's Haliburton rebuild crew to get done before we can call troops out. It's sickening.

 

Americans are sick and tired of the needless wars and the fiscal irresponsibility of these two assbag parties we have. It doesn't matter if the states try to secede. We all know its not gonna happen. The fact is people are this fed up. It's not an action, these people doing this. It's a message.

[BnBChumMaster]

The last three pages of this topic has just blown my hair back.

 

I just wanna know were you all get your bud from, because I must be growing the wrong shit.

 

" States want to Secede ". It will never happen. If you believe for a moment it might, you need to pack a bigger bowl to smoke.

[EmtHipple]

As i have said before on this topic while I do not think Secession is the right course of action, remember there is a history of secession in this county, Starting with the revolutionary war and continuing to this day enduring a full scale civil war and many,many small scale actions at local levels as well as counties seceding from each other. In closing secession is not a new concept, it is in fact the natural order of life and government. When a child grows they leave the parents home and set out on their own. Nor Is the thought of secession going away in the future for without the idea that people can better their situations then there is darkness. Think if your ancestors never stood up to the feudal lords and robber baron's, where would you be today.

[parrot]

As soon as I get my degree, I'm getting the hell out of Texas.

 

I love this state. Always have. I've only ever lived here my entire life. My family is here.

 

But I cannot in good conscience remain in a state led by such wildly irresponsible people. I can't allow my daughters to be educated in a state that denies evolution and thinks that abstinence only education is sufficent. A state that so proudly thumbs its nose at smart people and calls them "elite". A state that allows 25 percent of its citizens to languish without health insurance. A state led by a man and a party who feel government is ALWAYS the problem.

 

I'd like to move to California, or perhaps up north to New England.

 

@Deathhunter

 

If government never does anything good, well then move to Somalia. They have no government. Pure, unadulterated Capitalism at its finest.

[Matty_c]

Just to point out one other thing... Death you brought up the Social Security Administration as having purchased 174,000 rounds of ammunition.

 

While that is true, the rounds were purchased for their investigators who have full police powers and need to be armed when they walk into the houses of those individuals committing fraud against the system.

The conspiracy theorists love to say it is due to arming themselves against civil unrest, it's simply not true

 

When you take the 174,000 rounds and divide it by the 66 or so agents that is around 2,600 rounds per investigator. Given how much time they spend on qualifications and range time to practice, that probably leaves each officer with around 500 rounds available for "duty" (for the year). That's if they only do the minimum required range & qualification time...

 

Just felt it was necessary to point that out because I hate conspiracy theories and how they become tools in an argument about a real subject.

 

When it comes to the point of this topic I say "screw 'em, they want out then let 'em out"

 

I live in one of the most liberal states in the country so take that as you will. Anyone who thinks Romney gave a sh** about anyone who makes under $100,000 needs to get their head checked. I am not saying Obama is without flaws, it just always comes down to the lesser of two evils... We need strong education, and the rich can certainly afford to give back to the nation that allowed them to gain that wealth. Romney did not have a footing on either of those issues.

 

Now it all comes into wasteful spending and all that other jazz to clean up the debt but it should be a multi-pronged effort.

 

I worked in public accounting and if you could even see all the tax breaks that our rich counterparts are allowed to take it would make you sick to your stomach.

 

I like Dare's method anyways. There were some members that wanted to secede a while back, he banned them all

[EmtHipple]

Several points to make,1 Somalia was a socialist society prior to the 1991 civil war. after two decades of feudal/warlord rule the country is returning to a democratic state. The northern region of Somalia broke off relations with the south following the outbreak of war and declared themselves the Republic of Somaliland and retained fairly strong economy. The economy of the south has come along way too, The mainstays of it are in the livestock industry, remittance/money transfers and the telecom industry. Somalia's government is a very socialistic one once again, they are attempting to rebuild from years of war by giving the people everything they thinks they need.

 

2. The 25% of your states population that has no heath ins., what are they doing to improve their own situation and how are they languishing, whatever did the world do for the entire course of human history before the advent of the modern medical industrial complex?

Edited November 21, 2012 by EmtHipple

[parrot]

Several points to make,1 Somalia was a socialist society prior to the 1991 civil war. after two decades of feudal/warlord rule the country is returning to a democratic state. The northern region of Somalia broke off relations with the south following the outbreak of war and declared themselves the Republic of Somaliland and retained fairly strong economy. The economy of the south has come along way too, The mainstays of it are in the livestock industry, remittance/money transfers and the telecom industry. Somalia's government is a very socialistic one once again, they are attempting to rebuild from years of war by giving the people everything they thinks they need.

 

2. The 25% of your states population that has no heath ins., what are they doing to improve their own situation and how are they languishing, whatever did the world do for the entire course of human history before the advent of the modern medical industrial complex?

 

Re:Somalia

 

https://www.cia.gov/...o.html��clearly states no central government, only local authorities.

 

Re Point #2

 

Easy. Everyone just died. From the beginning of recorded history to the early 20th century, life expectancy averaged 20 to 40 years.

 

Sound like the good life?

 

http://ije.oxfordjou.../30/6/1260.full

 

How are we supposed to "better ourselves"? With no money for college, a job that pays minimum wage, and visits to the ER for routine medical care that ruin our credit? Please tell me what the average person is supposed to do?

 

Even if this person can get a Pell Grant for college that covers tution and books, how are they supposed to pay for rent and bills? Part time at minimum wage sure ain't gonna do it.

 

It is admirable (it really is) that you were able to forge a good life like you did. Please don't make the assumption that everyone else is as gifted and/or lucky. There are so many people that I know personally that work their ass off and never get ahead.

[EmtHipple]

Well I won't give credit to your info on Somalia until the link you posted doesn't go to a 404 dead link at the CIA please go to http://www.somaligov...Parliament.html for info directly from the federal republic of Somalia. I cant tell you that there are not local warlords still but I seems to me that Somalia is more stable than they have in decades. As a health care provider I have to ask why in the world you would go to a ER for routine medical care? Many Dr will take cash payments that are very reduced in rate due to not having to incur the additional cost of billing ins.companies. The increase in life expectancy has more to do with better sanitation, access to clean drinking water, quality food supply and better education. These have a profoundly high effect on the ALE than medical care alone. While the modern medical model has made advances in acute injury /illness recovery rates these PT's do not affect the over all life expectancy rate for a total population, so the statistical data you quote is irrelevant. Look to the far east for the answer to long life,people have been living in to their 100's for a long time in those countries at a time when European's and their descendants where living to a average age of mid 50's all without "modern pharmaceutical based healthcare". The real problem with affordable health care is the insurance industry and people just not paying their bill to the DR. The Affordable care act is not going to increase access to healthcare it is going to ruin the system for everyone and decrease the over all ability of the system to deal with the real emergencies that need expeditious care. Just because you do not go to collage does not mean you can not improve yourself. Education is a life long process that can cost nothing and be a enriching and positive experience for you and your family to learn together. The materials be accessed free of charge at any public library. Before entering the medical field I learned many trades on the job and by reading books on the subject at hand. Being gifted/lucky has little to do with success in life and more to do with sheer determination and perseverance. Please understand that this is not an attack on you, I wish nothing but good luck and happiness to you and your family , I am stating my feelings on these matters take them or leave them, they worked for me might not for you, but please don't sell yourself or other short and try and blame social/economic issues as the reason. Where there is a will there is a way..

[EmtHipple]

For my part I believe that I have said everything constructive that I care to on this subject. Farewell and see you in the game.

[Levi]

Well after losing my dog last week I haven't even thought about this matter which means there are obviously more important things going on then ignorant people. Now I was all for voting (Just to express my anger with the current president) to get away from the government. Just not important. This whole thing is dumb. The president is an idiot along with every other one that comes into office.

[EmtHipple]

I'm sorry to hear about your dog and we kind of got off topic anyway

[parrot]

https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/so.html

 

sorry some words got appended on there :/

 

Final thoughts:

 

a lot of truth in what you said about determinism and hard work. Not 100 percent true, but still more often than not.

 

re: routine medical care. I pay 80 bucks for a regular visit, plus anywhere from 5 to 100 bucks for any prescriptions. Any kind of blood work/x-ray/etc will, ofc, be extra.

 

My wife recently had excruciating pain in her ear. This was at 11pm at night, no minor emergency open, obviously no doctor open. She had been puking and running fever for three days prior, and had gone to work anyway. We didn't have the 80-100 bucks for a doc visit. We can't just go see a doc and pay later either, they want money up front (they ain't stupid). So instead of paying 150 or so (after medecine) we'll probably end up paying over a 1000 bucks for the ER visit.

 

The ability to see a doc for a 10 or 20 dollar co-pay could have prevented this. We would have saved money, the government would have saved money. My wife would have been spared the pain.

 

You're right about the escalating cost of care. Prevention is always cheaper, and preventing ER visits even more so.

 

Cya round in the game (come play on ET hardcore