ET Server Suggestion Silent1 and Others - !HowFair Cmd

[TheRoach]

Hello all and good evening, i think i would like to talk a bit more on a subject that got brought up in the wrong section of these forums, the !howfair Command. When i was in trial i was told this was a thing we are required to understand and use during this time. How ever after time and experience i feel that using the /scores combined with amount of players per team, Map progression is the right choice as an admin to determine where to balance teams. To  catch stacking I would watch the KR by hitting tab .Whats your thoughts? And please lets respond professionally. Thanks guys.

Edited June 26, 2020 by Roach88

[Mufasa]

It seems like you’re confused about what !howfair actually is. All it does it add the KR of each player on a team, then compare it to the other team - so when you say KR is more accurate, you’re arguing for !howfair. 
 

Map progression and actual scores will always be the best tool for balancing in the middle of a game, but they can’t be used at the beginning of a round. Looking past howfair is a good starting spot, and soon you’ll get a feel for when things need to be changed. 

[TheRoach]

28 minutes ago, Mufasa said:

It seems like you’re confused about what !howfair actually is. All it does it add the KR of each player on a team, then compare it to the other team - so when you say KR is more accurate, you’re arguing for !howfair. 
 

Map progression and actual scores will always be the best tool for balancing in the middle of a game, but they can’t be used at the beginning of a round. Looking past howfair is a good starting spot, and soon you’ll get a feel for when things need to be changed. 

I can see how it’s seems I’m arguing the KR point but it was meant to be two separate parts. I would use KR to monitor team stacking simply by watching how many high KRs per team. When I said KR I’m thinking of using this strictly for stacking, the others such as map progression , /scores , and amount of players I would use those for balancing teams. But in the beginning it makes sense I guess to depend on that. I just see it being used more frequently like throughout the game. Maybe we should clarify with members who use it when and how it should be used. Good point though @Mufasa

Edited June 26, 2020 by Roach88

[Syroox]

When I play on Silent ( has become rare lol)

I always check the teams as I do on Jaymod 

Map progression, Scores and amount of players 

K/R is inaccuratr in my opinion because you can get it better by playing vs bots

[Cross Marian]

A Lot of good points are being made here.

!howfair and tab+KR is definitely one indicator. It's not the only one, and surely not the best, but it is still useful (especially combined with others).

 

I'm using this topic to bump a great tutorial for trials and new members made by CheepHeep.

The question of how to balance teams and which indicators should be used is pretty clear there.

Edited June 26, 2020 by RendeL
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[Ellen]

About KR: I don't quite understand, why it is allowed for a player to reset his or hers KR. If you even sometimes use KR to check balances, it should not be allowed. Certain people reset several times when they are playing. Also never reseting is a problem since then KR won't move much, and skilled players can end up with much lower KR than their real level. I recommend either timed resets (like once a month) or resets by request done by an admin.

 

Regardless, when used properly KR does mesure what it is supposed to measure. That is kill to death ratio, and that only. Killing bots only won't raise it too much. If there is an issue with it, it is people who play on public servers as if they are some kind of ETPRO games where you don't even try to progress the obj. Long killing sprees are what raise KR the most and those you don't really need to complete objectives.

 

My solutions:

 

1) Remove KR reseting ability. Howfair command should be optimally used around 1m after map starts unless admin is able to otherwise check teams just by looking at player names. Servers auto shuffle at the start so sometimes players stay in spec until map has properly started.

2) Use few different shuffling (both auto and manual) techniques. When shuffle doesn't work it would be useful to have a different shuffling mechanism. Perhaps a combination of battle sense, XP gathered during last 1h or so, class related XP (medic, engi etc.) or something else. This way you can get different teams after each shuffle. 

3) Have some kind of general rules when /scores (kill difference) are unfair. Is 200 kill difference enough? 

4) Pay more attention to map progress. I believe teams in public games should be made such that attacking team should always have a fair shot at winning the game. Games are much more interesting when attackers are slightly stronger (not that it should be the goal) and other way around.

 

I realize some of these require a bit of coding. I don't expect them to be implemented just like that. But please, if you reply, please but some effort in thinking why my ideas might be good or bad.

[GHARIB]

4 hours ago, Cross Marian said:

A Lot of good points are being made here.

!howfair and tab+KR is definitely one indicator. It's not the only one, and surely not the best, but it is still useful (especially combined with others).

I totally agree with that, TAB+KR is useful indicator, and not the only one.

 

Sometimes the 'defending team' got more kills, because 'attacking team' is playing the objective, and get progressing through the game for example 'escorting a vehicle', even if they get killed more, they Will win the map. 

 

IMO, KR is Good indicator but assisted by The eye of experienced admin.