K/D

[TheDuck]

 

Why then players will eventually get 'stuck' to some killrating?

Because if, let's say, a player has always 2x kills than deaths, for example 40 kills 20 deaths every map, he will gain points 40 times, and lose points 20 times, so you think he will go up. But now comes the nice part: the higher his rating, the less points he will gain when he kills, and the more he will lose when he dies, so eventually the ratio will be 1:2, and with 40 frags he will gain exactly the same amount he loses with 20 deaths. So his k/d stays the same.

 

kapito?

 

Regardless of how you do the math it still equals out to K/D eventually not moving much in either direction. Aren't diminishing returns interesting? I get to watch this with the U.S. economy atm

[BattleFlag]

let me try to explain, since I think you still don't understand exactly how it works. Even if you start to understand better

 

The game stores your killrating (k/d). Now I'm too lazy to check etpub source, but as far as I remember (I did it in the past) it should be so. This means that you can have any number of kills and deaths, but only your rating will be 'remembered'.

 

you frag a player -> your rating goes up (if you frag a player with a higher k/d rating than yours, you gain more points)

you die -> your rating goes down (if a player with very low k/d kills you, for example a bot, you lose more points)

 

i can have 10000000 kills and 100000000 death but that doesn't matter, the only thing that matters is my rating and the other player's rating. Only rating counts, how fast you got that rating, and how, doesn't matter. A terrible player who played for years could give his etkey to you, and his rating will go up.

 

 

Why then players will eventually get 'stuck' to some killrating?

Because if, let's say, a player has always 2x kills than deaths, for example 40 kills 20 deaths every map, he will gain points 40 times, and lose points 20 times, so you think he will go up. But now comes the nice part: the higher his rating, the less points he will gain when he kills, and the more he will lose when he dies, so eventually the ratio will be 1:2, and with 40 frags he will gain exactly the same amount he loses with 20 deaths. So his k/d stays the same.

 

kapito?

yes m8 HO CAPITO ^^ but im not so sure its just that..i seen any new players with standard 1.000 to kill only bots with about 0.800 K/D.. and every kill he gained 0.020 or 0.030.. when i kill a player with my rating about (1.560 now) three time, i gain 0.001 maybe..how u explain it?

[SunLight]

yes m8 HO CAPITO ^^ but im not so sure its just that..i seen any new players with standard 1.000 to kill only bots with about 0.800 K/D.. and every kill he gained 0.020 or 0.030.. when i kill a player with my rating about (1.560 now) three time, i gain 0.001 maybe..how u explain it?

If you have 1000 you gain faster because you have a low score, I think. There's always an explanation, I just need to check that formula etpub uses to calculate this, but I'm too lazy atm.

 

Anyway, if I were you, I wouldn't worry much about k/d, if you are good you are good, and you can see it even in a single game, and without looking at the scoreboard.

Saw a player with a huge k/d, and he was good, I am not telling he wasn't. But he was camping somewhere all the time, man I barely met him twice in a whole map, and I was trying to find him, and attacking all the time. Didn't figure out where he camped, same thing as sl raters, you hear monsterkill dominating etc. and where are they? no idea. when I meet them I have a good chance to frag them, once I get past all their team mates they use as a lame shield.

And what's more he kept going to spec in maps he didn't like, or if his team wasn't strong enough... same shit as splatterladder or similar ratings, there's always people who try to gain score in unfair ways by exploiting the system.

 

Back to topic, I went from 3.000 to 3.200 in a couple of hours, it's normal that you gain only few points for 1 kill, just kill and don't die

but again this rating system is crap, how can you get points by killing someone with panzer? or mortar, safe in your spawn? total crap. If a player is good he is good and you'll see it, rating or not.

[gaoesa]

The K/D doesn't store only the rating but also the rating variance. The rating variance becomes smaller in time which makes the changes happen slower. This is the biggest reason for the K/D to move around very fast in the beginning.

 

I agree with SunLight though that in many cases if not allways, it does show values that are not correct. It can be usefull to admins though. Looking at all the K/D values in a team and comparing them to the opposing teams values can give an idea how the teams are. It's just not usefull for single players. It is practically impossible to make such a scoring system for single players in a game like ET where nothing remains constant and everything is affected by the team in total.

 

This is what Josh Menke from ETPub team attempts to implement.

http://axon.cs.byu.edu/~josh/etstats/update_bayes.pdf

[BattleFlag]

guys i agree about the rating is shit.. mine it was just a question..and i care a bit about my rate on server, coz i play clean and i wanna see my improvements..when I started to pay attention to K/D i was 1.100 i think.. and now i am 1.560 without panza or camping..and if i had started to see K/D when i played first time on etpub, maybe now it would be better.. but isnt so important..i dont cry if i lose 0.010 of rating in a day coz is bad day.. next day i will gain it.. its just to see, if i would care of rating, i would use SL.. i joined the site but are about 8 or 9 months that i dont enter there..

anyway thanks for expain ^^

[TheDuck]

Is there a way to rate based off of splatterladder? Perhaps as a way to go around doing this would be to take only people who are registered with guid on F|A forums, and cross reference on SL. Then once a week do a server maintenance on all servers and update k/d based off of their ratings?

[SunLight]

It is practically impossible to make such a scoring system for single players in a game like ET where nothing remains constant and everything is affected by the team in total.

right, but what about something like this:

 

- every time a bullet from a hitscan weapon (so no panzer, mortar etc) hits a player:

1. you check from a 2 dimensional array of all clients (where you store the last server time a player was hit) if the shooter and the victim had received damage from other people in the last, say, 4 seconds.

2. if not, then it's regarded as 1on1, you make a dot product of players point of view to avoid backshooting

3. this way you keep track of damage received and given in 1on1 from the front, so if a player gives me 2 times as much, he should be 2 times better, and his rating should move towards 2x my rating and vice versa.

3. if a player is 'new' his rating moves faster, and it won't influence 'old' players ratings, but only be influenced by those, in such a way that in a couple of maps that player rating would be approximately right.

 

Since damage has more samples taken it would go faster to the right value than kills, and without taking into account 2vs1 and stuff, there would be no way for a bad player to just 'steal' or do something to have a high rating, well, unless he is an aimbotter...

 

Wouldn't this be a better model for individual player fighting skill?